 |
| Ch. Kan Ya Ma Kan Deglet Nour |
Elisa Muccini interview Roberto Forsoni
What did you find so charming about Saluki that made you choose them as your favorite dog breed?
My passion for dog has began long time ago, I can say it's almost inborn, it started in 1990 when I was 23 years old and I took part to my first dog show. In 1991 I had my first Saluki, Atash, he wasn't the typical show dog, but he has really changed my life. A great passion for this breed as started, for its origin and for everything it represents but above all for its special temper and for the elegance it expresses. I started to inform myself in the usual ways: buying some English and American magazines and contacting by mail the most important breeders, unfortunately , but as well luckily, internet easiness wasn't available at that time. The net gives you a great amount of information but most are surface information; if you want to study an uncommon breed as Saluki the best way is reading specific and old books and magazines.
How did you choose the name for your kennel?
My wife Stefania and I in 1996 decided to go to the Middle East for our honeymoon, and among all the trips offered there was one called Kan Ya Ma Kan, and there were some lines saying “Kan Ya Ma Kan it's the way Arabs stars to tell fairy tales to children, as we say 'once upon a long ago'..., to say the truth the Arab version has a really untranslatable meaning which reminds the things made in a kind of old style way, as if our historical memory is still in our present and we can't live without it”
It was a lucky coincidence, that name had to be my kennel name, it really meant what I considered the essence of Saluki, a very ancient breed that still is preserved in time as it was “a long time ago”. When the FCI accepted my name I was really happy.
Have you ever thought, when you were a child, about becoming a Saluki breeder?
I had this idea after meeting the Salukis.
Did you spend your childhood with dogs or did your interest for them come later?
When I was a child I was close to a family dog, my father used to hunt, it was a Pointer, suddenly he left us when I was so young and since that time no dog has entered our house 'till I was 24.
In your opinion what is the best thing in breeding dogs?
The satisfaction in planning a breeding, making an evaluation of parents; the miracle of birth and the delight when I seem them growing up it's something incomparable. The most interesting thing is seeing again, one year after, the litters and check if my provisions were right.
Can you tell us something about your first Salukis?
My first show dog was Mabrooka Sariyah, Italian Champion, Breeding Champion and mother of 5 Italian Champions; she arrived to Italy in 1996 thanks to Anne MacDonald. Breeding was already in my plans and I just wanted to start with a typical English Saluki. The English blood lines were to me the classical Saluki standards. Sarì wasn't perfect but she had an extraordinary breed expression, that allowed her to get a rBIS in a national show when she was only 13 months.
From the beginning my goal was working with a typical Saluki, as English dogs quite often were, this harmonized with a good movement and a charisma, that the American origins often bring with. The choice of my second blood line was the Baghdad Kennel, by Ron Chato and Bockman, Australian with American origins. In 1997 we imported, the never forgot, Ambi (Baghdad Ambassador), son of the marvelous Ch. Baghdad Talk of the Town. He gave us my first litter, among the best I have ever had and from which we got the multi Champion Al Lu Lua Min Layla.
After some years and with more experience do you think you would do everything in the same way?
It would be easy to say yes, but experience makes the difference, when I say this I don't mean to doubt the blood lines I started with and which I still keep working with, because I considered and I still consider them the best lines to start with. I mean the patience that one who decides to breed has to have, trying, as much as it's possible, to get an adult dog instead of a puppy, which, as its nature, will have an unpredictable development.
Which are the blood lines you based your breeding on?
My breeding plan is essentially based on these two blood lines, which are obviously compatible, as Anne MacDonald used the Baghdad line for the J litter some years after, this litter got wonderful saluki, among them the famous Ch. Mabrooka Jayid, who won nel 2002 e 2005 the BOB at the Crufts and in 2002 the Best of Group. Jayid is the father of my D litter, from which I got Digli (Ch. Kan Ya Ma Kan Deglet Nour), he was Top Sighthound 2005 and father of the E and J litter, J litter of the Mata Salamata Kennel and of the I litter of the Dabka Kennel. Another lines introduced, and which I have ever admired for its elegance, is Mata Salamata, for my F litter. In 2003 my friend Ombretta Casazza and I imported Zimmo (Ch. Aziim Alfora Noble Kan Ya Ma Kan), grandson of Bashir (Ch. Clarinda Sunna Sarea Bashir).
Bashir was already in my breeding plan when in 1999 I used one of his sons Ch. Sundown Shamshi Adad (brother of the American record girl Ch. Sundown Alabaster Treasure) for my B litter. Zimmo gave us only one litter of one puppy Ghibli (Ch. Kan Ya Ma Kan Gale). My friends (first my wife) blame me because I use my best males one or maximum two times, there are two reasons for this: the first is that in an quite uncommon breed as Saluki the gene pool is restricted, so using a males for many times could pauperize the gene variety; I never choose the easy way but the one I considered the best for lasting results.
The second reason is that I would like to use a male many times when I will find my ideal male to give my kennel a strong imprinting, this hasn't happened yet. Maybe it won't happen, even because as time passes, I've become more critical and demanding with my own dogs.
Do your begging choices satisfy the results you achieved 'till now?
Absolutely they do, I mean the benefits are more than disadvantages. Well if you ask me if I got the ideal Saluki, luckily I have to say no, because this is my goal, and once I achieved it my work will end. We breed for an ideal and this has to be forever, in my opinion, it's impossible to breed the perfect dog for two reasons: the goal is hard to reach and the more years pass the more critical one becomes.
Clearly I've never met the ideal Saluki, I saw and I had some extraordinary dogs, bur they never were ideal nor perfect.
How did you use the inbreeding, the linebreeding and the outcrossing in your breeding plans?
We use outcrossing to add ore modify, the inbreeding and the linebreeding to keep and strengthen.
At the beginning we usually use the outcross. Everyone has a different own personal idea of how a Saluki has to be, if a existing kennel has all you need we won't need to breed.
We breed because we think we can add something positive to our breed and because we think we can achieve the perfect Saluki using specific dogs from specific kennels.
We use linebreedind to work with what we introduced.
In your opinion which is your best Saluki?
 |
| Ch. Baghdad Let's Dance |
Ghibli (Multi Ch. Kan Ya Ma Kan Gale), Eva's son (Ch. Baghdad Let's Dance), so grandson of the famous Jordan (Multi Ch. Baghdad Crème de la Crème) and Zimmo's son (Ch. Aziim Alfora Noble Kan Ya Ma Kan), owned by Mr. And Mrs. Panizza. A correct male with a great movement and with something special that only the bests have.
What are the results that satisfied you most?
Every breeder achieves some goals in the years, I my 12 years as a breeder I've produced and owned 41 Salukis, they won 33 championship and many BOB in Italy and abroad. Among all those victories there are some I consider important: the BOB in Donaueschingen in 2008 with Ghibli (that time Mata Salamata's Jade - Deglet Nour's daughter got the BOS) and the BIS with Ghibli in a specialty sighthound in 2008 in Italy.
But what satisfyed me the most was when important and estimated European breeders used my males to enrich their breeding program. This is, in my opinion, not a single victory but the long job estimation. I take part to shows only few times a year, no more than 6-7 times, but I never miss sighthound specialties, which I consider a very important moment to confront. I love to go to the main European events without my dogs this gives the chance to observe.
The Salukis and their job, talk about your experiences?
In 1993 I founded the Baraka Club, an association whose mission is to organize Racing and Coursing.
The Baraka Club organized the first ENCI Coursing and the first with the CACL release, I believed and I still believe in the sport activity of our sighthound, but I do have my own opinion about the functionality of these tests. I think these tests can not give definitive information about our dogs' ability to hunt, so we can not consider them as a work in the real meaning of the word; they can give us information about the run after ability, about their skills, about their endurance and speed, but they can not give us indications on the abilities to catch the prey in the best way, and this is the difference between a sighthound and other dogs, so what we would like to know and we can not do using these tests: all the dogs can learn how to run after (for example in US there are Coursing where all the dogs can take part), many dogs can be agile or fast, but only the sighthounds have the inborn skill to chase running after the prey, and it won't be easy to keep this inborn ability, even if the real hunt (with live preys) is allowed in few countries only. We know that if don't foster a character we lose it in few generations. the hunt ability is more an mental attitude than a physical one. And this is true especially for breeds that chase in the long distance, which are not based on the pure speed, so for the east sighthounds.
 |
| Al Lu Lua Min Layla |
If this is your belief why do you take part to Coursing training?
Because the dog enjoys itself, because it helps to keep it in good shape, because I observe the hunt skill, the physical strength, the body strength, the skill to change course in very little space and ardor it expresses.... but I'll never know if it will be a good hunter. So go Lure coursing because it gives me all these information without being assumptive.
Are there any Salukis of the past that you will be proud to produce and why?
I've admired many Salukis of the past I saw in a picture or in a video, but in my opinion making a good evaluation needs to see a dog live. So among all I've seen live I would say that Ch. Mata Salamata's Jadaan Khan is the one who impressed me more.
What are the characters ( male and female) you based the choice of your breedings on?
 |
| Multi Ch. Kan Ya Ma Kan Inaya |
In my opinion in the evaluation of a Saluki we must consider 3 categories: the type, the structure and the movement.
First there are, at the same level, type and movement, and then structure. I mean I can tolerate some little lacks in structure, but it's hard for me to tolerate lacks of type and movement; in fact a good movement implies a good structure. For example a wrong head poise usually means that the shoulder is not rightly inclined. I love to see an elegant movement as elegant as every sighthound should be, proper as a proper movement expressed by a proper structure has to be and above all, in a male, proud as proud as a dog with very good temper has to be. A dog vigorous in the ring will be more vigorous in a hunt field, on the contrary, it's well known, that a dog very lazy in the ring will be indolent to external stimulus, outside the ring, as well.
 |
| Ch. Kan Ya Ma Kan Gale |
How important is for you temper is in comparison to the functional beauty?
Temper is obviously very important. According to standards Salukis are reserved with strangers but this doesn't mean they are shy nor aggressive with people. In their origin countries Salukis are reluctant but absolutely not fearful. In the past I had some dogs with a little friendly character, so I worked on this feature, and now, I have to say, that the “risk” is that my dogs are too friendly, but if I consider the place where I live this is much better. In fact we allowed ourselves to bring to our cities these dogs, which for ages were used to live in huge spaces where this privacy couldn't be a problem, but breeding dogs so reserved in a place like the one we live in causes a deep uneasiness to the animal itself and to the owner who has to live with it.
Why did you decide to become a Saluki judge?
I started my procedure to become a judge to have the chance to better see and know Salukis. If you observe dogs from the ring side you will get less information than those you can get as a judge who can touch them.
From a judge point of view what do think about Salukis today in Italy?
Surely it's better than some years ago. Well I have to say that it seems to me that there's more interest in choosing the blood lines. There are very good Italian other breeds kennels, so I hope that in the future there will be good Italian Saluki Kennels as well.
Do you think that Salukis still respect the standard in Italy and abroad?
The Standard is not so restrictive so it allows a huge variability, a variability we look for because of the wide area of origin. So it's difficult to say if a Saluki is outside the standard.
As all the sighthound Salukis are great hunters, do you think there are dogs able to excel both in their job and in shows?
Where live hunting is allowed ( this is the only “job” we consider) there are dogs which are champions in both specialties.
For years you were publisher of a sighthound magazine, how did you develop the project and why, unfortunately, did this experience end?
The Baraka Book was born in 1995, from a knowledge need of mine. For years I've been in touch with other breeders, to whom I used to ask many questions, and I was sure that, because nothing similar existed at that time, many others were in my situation. So I opened to all the X Group, and the Baraka was born, thanks to the members of my team I met during this experience, I still want to thank all of them for the wonderful adventure. The name came from an Arab word they used to call Salukis, this means “the blessed”.
The magazine needs an important commitment and dedication, things I couldn't longer keep after 9 years.
How many litters do you produce a year?
In 12 years I've produced 9 litters.
How do you choose the most promising puppy?
This is a “sad”subject. It's always difficult to choose a puppy, so I really appreciate those who are able to make an evaluation even when puppies are just born without hesitation.
Maybe for this I need more experience, so for the moment I'm not able to give advice, I can only say that I'm very attentive to the movement, because a puppy that doesn't have a good movement when it is 3 months old, will hardly come out right.
Have you ever repented yourself of the investments made to reach specific goals?
If we talk about investments(time, money and energy) that gave me results, I don't have regrets, but as regards those that didn't give me the results I expected, well, I would say that I'll never do them again, but it's easy to be wise after the event.
Do you think that the Show World has changed since the day you started?
Not so much, but now the new generations are more superficial and especially more arrogant. They claim to become expert in few years.
If you see yourself in the future how do you imagine your kennel's development?
I'm not looking for striking results, that's why my presence at shows acts as a function of my kennel only.
Collecting championship titles before the name of a dog has a very poor meaning, my idea of love of dog is “ancient”. The real difference is between a champion dog and a dog which is not a champion, but what makes the difference between a champion and a multi champion it's only the kind of investment we are ready to make. I may sound extremist, but I can say that in dogs competitions the BOB only is important, the rest is show. My goal is high quality constant over time, and all this working with small groups, at the moment I'm living with 5 Salukis. I give a special attention to health as well. A good breeder is not one who ignores problems, but neither one who gives up when there's a problem. A good breeder has to know when to change course in the right direction when there's an obstacle.
What do you think of the diatribe about accepting or not the brindles?
As a breeder and a judge I think we have to breed and judge according to the country current standard. For the FCI Brindles are undesirable so I wouldn't like having a brindle in my kennel or in an Italian ring. But if I would have to judge in a country where brindles are accepted (or maybe I have to say “not excluded”) I will evaluate it as any other combinations of colors. As regards the brindles philological fairness we have to consider that it's historically accepted that Lady Amherst was portrayed with a brindle Saluki.
Is there something that we missed and that you would like to tell us?
Well, I would like to say 2 things. First I suggest to those who want to deepen their knowledge of this breed to read the standard in the original version, to avoid distortions and bad interpretations due to a wrong translation.
Second, always linked to the standard, I would urge judges and breeders to focus on 3 fundamental words of the standard: moderation, grace and symmetry.
“Any way, without talking at length, we will define beauty as the harmony of all the limbs, in the unity of which they are part of, based on a specific law, so that you can not add or remove or change anything without worsening it” Leon Battista Alberti A perfect quote to describe Salukis.
If we use this quote literally we will eliminate the excesses and extremism that we sometimes see in the victorious.
Salukis have a primordial and simple beauty, that comes from the oldest form of appreciation: harmony. A good Saluki is a typical example of what is beautiful to see.
Thank you so much for sharing your experiences with our readers, it was very kind.
ARTICLE FIRST APPEARED ON 'LEVRIERI', THE CLUB DEL LEVRIERO MAGAZINE in 2009
